O'Reilly Auto Parts Tried to Sell Me Compression Fittings

"Urambo Tauro" (urambotauro) 04/17/2018 at 12:00 • Filed to: brakes, compression fittings, wrenching, rustventures

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Here you go. Cash or credit?

And I specifically asked for brake line fittings.

While helping my sister wrench on her T-bird, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! brake fluid leaking at the Brake Pressure Control Valves. I managed to locate a place that offers BPCV !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , but only for limited applications. After some e-mails and careful measurements, they discovered that they had the right parts to start offering a kit for this application too. Huzzah!

But the battle wasn’t over yet. During disassembly, we discovered that there was enough rust to keep half of the flare nuts from turning independently of their lines. The result: twisted and broken brake lines.

This left her with two options. Either find the other end of each broken line, and replace the whole piece, or cut the line a few inches away from the valve blocks and splice a new section into each old line.

The car seemed to be more or less assembled around the brake lines, which were in otherwise good shape. So we decided to proceed with the second option. We picked a spot just a few inches away from the valve blocks, where the lines were straight and relatively easy to access.

This is where the battery and its mounting tray sit. Just enough room to work a flaring tool.

My sister cut the lines, and I fabbed up some replacement ends out of NiCopp. The old flare nuts were as good as new after drilling the old steel tubing out of the center of the nut, and cleaning up the threads a little.

All we needed now was some flare nuts and unions to tie these new sections into the lines that were still on the car. (Oh, and a quart of brake fluid too.)

We went to the local O’Reilly store, and they weren’t very busy. We were greeted upon entry, and I told them that we needed some brake line fittings for 3/16" tubing. (Note that I didn’t say “flare”, but I did say “brakes”.)

The guy at the counter nodded his head and directed us to follow him to the hardware aisle, where he soon produced this package.

OH !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

He didn’t seem fazed when I clarified that I wanted flare fittings. They have those too, and he’d be no less happy to sell me those instead. He mentioned something about “high pressure” compression fittings, which I wasn’t about to spend a lot of time researching as I had already made up my mind to flare these lines. (Now that I’ve had a chance to look them up, Google tells me that they do exist after all. However, these ain’t them.)

Could these have worked? Maybe. Temporarily. A compression fitting would have held pressure up to a point. If one was to go gentle on the brakes, you might get away it for a little while. Maybe that’s why !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! likes these things.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

I was going to turn this post into a full rant on everything wrong with compression fittings, but I’m missing a critical piece of information. I’m not sure how much pressure these fittings can actually hold. Is it because there are too many variables with associated with installation?

Dorman’s website does not provide a pressure rating for the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . They simply say “not recommended for hydraulic brake systems”. A product Q&A from !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! claims that “metal compression fittings may provide a reliable seal up over 200 psi to 220 psi”.

Here’s a similar product from !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , with an advertised working pressure of 1200 PSI. That’s right on the edge of possibly working for some cars, but there are plenty of cars out there that can generate several hundred more PSI. Could be handy for an emergency off-road repair, at least.

Dorman 800-202

And then here’s a high-pressure union that Dorman says is rated for 5000 PSI: the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

That’s more that the working pressure on the lines themselves!

There’s just one problem, though. We shouldn’t even be hemming and hawing over whether compression fittings will work, because they’re illegal to use on brake lines. At least they are in some areas, from what I’m hearing.

I’m having trouble finding an actual law on the books, but a lot of people are saying that it’s an insta-fail if you take your car in for an inspection and they find even one compression fitting on the brake lines. We don’t have safety inspections on passenger cars here in Michigan, but if these things are prohibited by federal law, then the point is moot.

Maybe these things can be safe. Maybe they can’t. Maybe they’re illegal. Maybe they aren’t. But they certainly shouldn’t be the first thing that comes to mind when suggesting a method of brake line repair.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:08

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The car seemed to be more or less assembled around the brake lines

Ford S.O.P., as far as I’m aware. My Galaxie was very clearly piped before the body went on.

crowmolly > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:12

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They are illegal in NJ and I’ve (politely) stopped salespeople from giving them to people when I’ve been in-store. More than a few times.

Yes, there are higher pressure compression fittings. But they are typically not sold on a parts store spindle display. There’s also another issue aside from pressure- people buy these to patch old brake lines with new line sections. To do this, the ferrule has to be installed on old brake lines that may be already weakened. And the union may be installed by an amateur that doesn’t understand that you need to be careful with the fittings and not just crank ‘er down.

Takuro Spirit > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:21

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What worries me is they have a whole RACK of them there....

What you want (and believe me you’re better off finding them yourself then asking for someone behind the counter to find them for you, case in point) is their line of Edelmann fittings.

So long as you know the size and type of flare it should be easy to research the part number online first before going into the store.

That’s what I always do at work. I don’t trust them counter monkeys. Fuckers don’t even know what a TIE ROD JAM NUT is.

crowmolly > Takuro Spirit 04/17/2018 at 12:22

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They’re OK for fuel lines. But should probably be marked as such.

LOREM IPSUM > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:22

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Few years ago I went into Lordco looking for some exhaust fittings. Asked the guy behind the counter for advice and he barked “how should I know, YOU’RE the mechanic.”

Yeah. A lot of big box parts store employees suck. I try to deal with smaller independent parts retailers whenever possible now. Better prices, more knowledgeable staff, and they actually act like they need your business, because they do.

I’ve got nothing of value to say about the compression fitting situation, but if in doubt it’s probably best to do it the conventional way. Complete brake failure is nooooo fun.

$kaycog > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:26

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Oh really?

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > crowmolly 04/17/2018 at 12:27

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May be already weakened and definitely don’t have a seal-worthy exterior finish anymore.

Urambo Tauro > $kaycog 04/17/2018 at 12:30

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Oh- oh- oh- oh really.

Takuro Spirit > crowmolly 04/17/2018 at 12:33

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But the employees there should know better.

Urambo Tauro > Takuro Spirit 04/17/2018 at 12:33

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You said “flare”, so I take it you’re not referring to Edelmann compression fittings...

My bird IS the word > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:50

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Is flaring...really that hard? I am about to find out, but still. advance will loan me the tools for it.

BigBlock440 > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 12:52

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A few years ago, I had a two-circuit failure in my truck 100 miles from home. I ended up coasting to a stop in an advance auto parking lot, where I bought brake line, fluid, and a fitting to at least fix the front leak, as the rear was mostly inaccessible. The “union” fitting that the guy gave me was a compression fitting. Didn’t know it at the time that it was a bad idea to use on a brake line until my friend in the area who help me fix it told em it was illegal (he had his inspection license and did inspections). But it got me home, and I still haven’t fixed it, nor has it leaked yet, going on 4 years. Apparently nobody that’s inspected it has seen it either.

Urambo Tauro > My bird IS the word 04/17/2018 at 12:56

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Steel lines can be a pain to work with, especially if you don’t have a quality flaring tool, as I recently discovered . Almost all of my brake line work is done using NiCopp , though.

If you’re new to flaring, try the steel first until you’ve made at least a couple of successful flares. Focus on making perfectly square cuts and make sure that the flaring tool is lined up perfectly, too. Don’t forget to make a few bends in the tubing if you’re just playing around with a test piece.

After that, try the NiCopp. You’ll love it.

Urambo Tauro > BigBlock440 04/17/2018 at 13:21

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This sounds like a very good install on non-rusty sections of line. Or maybe you’ve been lucky enough to not have to make any hard stops. Maybe it’s a little of both, or your truck just isn’t generating as much hydraulic pressure as some other cars do.

This was a rear line, right? If these are drum brakes, they don’t receive as much pressure as the front calipers do.

If you ever have a chance to put a brake pressure gauge on it, I’d love to hear how much pressure those fittings are actually holding.

My bird IS the word > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 13:34

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I already bought nicopp lol. I’ll still have to flare one steel end though. I only needed a little to replace a section of a different diameter so I got stuck buying local.

Urambo Tauro > My bird IS the word 04/17/2018 at 13:44

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You’ll want to make your cut far back enough where the metal is still good. When you do that, the cast-off piece should have good metal at the cut end, so you can get at least one practice run out of it before committing to flaring the line still on the car. Don’t forget to slide the nut on before flaring! (been there done that haha)

My bird IS the word > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 13:47

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Luckily these are for fuel lines. NAPA pre flared the line but I am sure I am going to need to trim it, may just trim it to get the nuts off. Flaring the scrap piece for practice is a good idea though, thanks. Luckily these can be off a little because they are connected by hose.

Urambo Tauro > My bird IS the word 04/17/2018 at 13:53

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Fuel lines, hm. I wonder if compression fittings would be legal for those. The pressure is well within spec. I’m sure they would hold just fine. I mean, we’re not talking about hundreds and hundreds of PSI here...

(But even if that was an option, good on you for taking this opportunity to learn flaring instead.)

My bird IS the word > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 14:12

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I wouldn’t use them for fuel injection maybe, that’s moderate pressure. however, I’m using carb line and it would be more than sufficient. all mine are connected with rubber hoses so it’s just way too easy to replace.

BigBlock440 > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 14:14

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It was both, I fixed the front with the compression fitting, then when I got to my parents house, fixed the rear with a long section I had to route around the gas tank. I don’t put that many miles on it, maybe 10k in those 4 years, but I don’t think I’ve had to do any hard stops. It’s something I try to avoid in the truck, because it’s a truck. I know I should fix it, it’s accessible enough, but it hasn’t given me problems yet.

But yeah, odd that the compression fitting is the first thing the parts counter guys reach for, especially when the correct fittings are right there next to them.

Urambo Tauro > My bird IS the word 04/17/2018 at 14:46

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Yeah, you’re looking at, what, single-digit PSI? That’s nothing. But even going with the lowest rating (200-220 PSI) from the Advance Auto website, metal compression fittings should be more than sufficient for fuel injection too.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > BigBlock440 04/17/2018 at 15:50

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Until the next panic stop...

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 15:51

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Nylon brake lines are the new thing.

Urambo Tauro > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 04/17/2018 at 16:10

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[desire to know more intensifies]

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 16:16

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#iwaskidding

Urambo Tauro > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 04/17/2018 at 16:23

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Haha, thought so. But they do exist...

I used nylon tubing to replace the fuel lines in my truck, but that’s not the kind that would work for brakes. These ones are supposedly “race proven”, but also “not for street use”. I wonder what that’s supposed to mean. Are they tough enough or are they not?

BigBlock440 > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 04/17/2018 at 16:30

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I’ll still have half the front and full rear. But I’ve never actually had to do a full-force panic stop. I don’t think I’ve ever once hit my brakes as hard as I could, I have no idea how short my braking distance could be in any of my vehicles.

BigBlock440 > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 16:31

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Not for street use means no DOT certification, so yes?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 16:37

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I thought what I said would be seen as patently absurd and I fully assumed that no such thing existed.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > BigBlock440 04/17/2018 at 16:39

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I recently made a gentle stab at the brakes in my 2012 Nissan Versa and the pedal went right to the floor. Repeatedly. I used the handbrake to stop the car. I turned the engine off, then restarted, and the brakes returned. I bought a new master cylinder from Nissan and promptly replaced the old one.

Urambo Tauro > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 04/17/2018 at 16:45

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Apparently they’re a thing!

Urambo Tauro > BigBlock440 04/17/2018 at 16:45

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I’m not sure how they could fail DOT certification if they can handle the rigors of racing. Maybe they just haven’t gone through the certification process?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Urambo Tauro 04/17/2018 at 16:46

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Woodna thunk it.

Junkrat aka Rick Sanchez: Fury Road Edition > Urambo Tauro 04/18/2018 at 01:44

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Exactly, they didn’t go through with the certification for whatever reason. Doesn’t mean that it’s not good.

Meatcoma > Urambo Tauro 04/18/2018 at 13:16

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Comes down to the person installing I’d say.

BigBlock440 > Urambo Tauro 04/19/2018 at 08:20

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That’s what I mean, certifications cost money and probably have a bunch of other requirements that I don’t know. Probably requires a specific paper trail, etc. It’s easier to just slap a label that says “not for street use” on it than having to worry about conforming to whatever’s required of certification, because you know nobody’s going to actually care about that sticker. Just like a lot of other performance parts and tuners, they label them “for offroad use only”, but nobody pays attention to that.

BigBlock440 > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 04/19/2018 at 08:33

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Oh I’ve fully lost brakes in this truck, both front and rear, had to use the parking block at advance auto to stop. That’s where they sold me the compression fitting. But it wasn’t a full-force panic stop when I initially tried to stop, and it wasn’t a full-force panic stop after that either as I planned it out cruising down the shoulder in L. That’s what the concerns with compression fittings are, when the pressure gets too high.